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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  February 11, 2014 5:00pm-6:01pm PST

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america, the person invited in your home every night to share the news for decades. he's a generous, kind and deeply loyal man to all who know him. we wish him a brave battle tonight. "ac 360" starts right now. good evening. get ready. breaking news tonight. millions of americans tonight facing what could be the worst winter storm in nearly a decade and a half. we'll show you who is in harm's way tonight. also why did this man pump shot after shot into an suv full of teenagers? hear from the defendant himself in the loud music murder trial and decide for yourself whether to believe his story of self-defense. and later, some kids covered their eyes because they could not bear to see a giraffe killed, cut up and then fed to the lions. the question is, what made a zoo in denmark think this was a good idea? and why did they even kill that giraffe? i'll talk to the zoo official who made the decision and we'll hear from jack hannah who's more than just mad.
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we begin tonight with breaking news. a winter storm that some fear will make atlanta's recent weather nightmare look like almost nothing. this what is two inches of snow and ice did to the city just a couple of weeks ago. no doubt you remember. the storm that's getting ready to pummel the southeast tonight could be the worst in 14 years. take a look at it from space stretching there from texas through virginia and farther north along the eastern seaboard. it's in georgia, though, and the carolinas that will be the first to get the worst of it. not just out on the roads which could look like this shortly. that's because even if you stay at home you could end up in darkness for days when inches of ice meet miles of power lines. right now snow is falling north of atlanta. not wanting to get caught off guard like last time, the georgia governor declare add state of emergency for 89 counties telling georgians we are not kidding and we are not crying wolf. president obama declared a state of emergency as well, freeing up federal resources in case things get bad. more than 2,000 flights have already been canceled for
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wednesday. we learned that delta employees will be sleeping in planes at atlanta airport during the storm because there aren't enough hotel rooms for everyone. serious stuff tonight. let's check in with chad myers in the weather center. they're calling this storm potentially crippling. what should the southeast expect? >> ice. and the ice is going to be rain on the way down and freeze when it gets down here. that's the issue. it's the ice that will collect on the trees and grow and grow and grow, and then that tree will fall down. it has no choice because it's just simply too heavy. and here is the storm right now. if you're coming out of texas into louisiana but it's on its way to mississippi, alabama and georgia tonight. the issue is that aloft. anderson, i'm talk about 3,000 feet up in the sky. it's going to be 36 degrees. that's because the warm air from the gulf of mexico is going to ride up on top of the cold air. then that 36-degree rain is going to rain down into our atmosphere where it's going to
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be 29 and it's going to freeze. it doesn't have a choice. when it gets farther to the north it will be thick enough that it will be all snow. that snow is d.c., philadelphia, new york, probably 10 inches in new york city, 10 ins in philadelphia, 8 to 12 in washington, d.c. all the way up the east coast, boston, hartford, everyone gets the same storm. it's the ice storm down here that will bring down a million trees, a million power lines and leave some people without power i think for weeks. >> it's a nightmare at airports across the country. i was in texas this morning, i flu out of dallas. american airlines canceled flights, u.s. air canceled flights. delta finally flew out this morning. the storm is causing thousands of cancellations over the next couple days at major airports. that's only going to get worse, right? >> atlanta is 36 degrees and nothing's going on. drizzling. that's not the problem. the problem is that there should be 100 or so planes in the sky to atlanta. there are 30. 30 planes to atl right now. all of the west coast planes have already been canceled.
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all the planes that would be on the ground all night will not be on the ground all night. all those planes are leaving. they're all going to get out of atlanta because they don't want to get buried in the ice. except for the planes that the delta people will be sleeping in on the tarmac because some of those seats do reclin. you still want to get the ones that don't reclin in the exit rows. this is going to be a devastating effect for wednesday, thursday, even into friday. this doesn't get a lot better. >> i've not heard of crews sleeping on the planes in a long time. chad, thanks very much. by this time tomorrow a florida jury could be deciding the fate of michael dunn, the man who opened fire on a vehicle full of teens outside a convenience store after an altercation over loud music. the two sides rested but not before dunn took the stand, something that surprised a lot of people frankly who have been following the trial. not a lot of people thought he was going to do that. dunn told jurors why he pumped shot after shot into the suv killing 17-year-old jordan davis and then recounting what happened next.
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we have more from martin savidge. >> reporter: from the witness stand, 47-year-old michael dunn gave a simple reason for firing nine shots into an suv with four teens inside. >> i thought i was going to be killed. >> reporter: dup says he and his fiancee pulled into a jacksonville gas station next to a red dodge durango playing music so loud his own car was vibrating. >> body panels in the suv were rattling, my rear-view mirror was shaking. my ear drums were vibrating. this was ridiculously loud music. >> reporter: while his fiancee was in the store, dunn says politely spoke to the teens. >> i said can you turn that down, please? they turned it off. if the music wasn't off at least the bass stopped completely. >> that the point what did you say? >> i said thank you. >> moments later dunn said the problem was back up and jordan davis in the back passenger seat was using racially insanity.
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>> i heard him say i should kill that mother [ mute ]. i'm f i'm flabbergasted. >> reporter: he says he tried to deescalate the conversation by saying are you talking to me? >> he stuck something above the door. i saw above the window sill about 4 inches of a barrel. >> reporter: from then on dunn described an escalating series of actions by the 17-year-old. >> now door opens, and this young man gets out. and as his head clears the window frame, he says "this shit's going down now. >> reporter: dunn says he fired nine shots into the suv, even stepping out of his own car to continue shooting as the suv drove off. >> i didn't aim, i pointed. i was fighting for my life.
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>> reporter: dunn says he was afraid the suv would return. and unaware he'd hit anyone, he and his fiancee drove to their hotel, never calling police. but davis was hit three times. he died a short time later. and police say no gun was found. on cross-examination, john guy pounced on dunn saying the moments and hours after the shooting he never told his fiancee the teens had a gun. dunn maintains he did. >> you never told the love of your life that those boys had a gun? >> you weren't there. >> reporter: it was the start of a contentious back and forth with guy hammering dunn over his story. guy said the two vehicles were parked so close it would have been impossible for a raging jordan to get out as dunn said he did. he then said self-defense was not the real moat. >> i have -- motive. >> jordan davis was never a threat. >> yes, he was. >> reporter: dunn said the following day he reported the incident to a friend in federal
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law enforcement to begin surrendering. but he says dunn made no call. his fiancee said the same. she damaged his testimony even more when asked if dunn ever told her the teens were armed, something dunn swore he did -- >> did the defendant ever tell you he saw a gun in that red suv? >> no. >> did the defendant ever tell you that he saw a weapon of any kind in that suv? >> no. >> there was no mention of a stick? >> no. >> there was no mention of a shotgun? >> no. >> there was no mention of a barrel? >> no. >> there was no mention of a lead pipe. >> no. >> reporter: martin savidge, cnn, jacksonville, florida. >> let's bring in our equal justice panel. former federal prosecutor and criminal defense attorney. sunny, it's interesting. he seemed very confident on the stand. and it's not often you see a defendant like that take the stand. and then his fiancee basically undercut a lot of the stuff that he so confidently said he told
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her. you were there for the testimony. what was it like in the courtroom? do you think it was a good day for the government? >> yeah, i do think it was a good day for the government. i will tell you, anderson, that the courtroom was absolutely packed. people were shoulder to shoulder. and the jury was riveted when michael dunn was on the witness stand. and so at first the appearance was wow, he probably did okay. but on cross-examination, i think that john guy played it just right. it was very well-played. it was effective. it wasn't over the top. many people are saying he didn't do enough. well, that is what makes a good prosecutor. you don't want to go too far. you're never going to get the moment that jack nickelson and tom cruise got in "a few good men" where jack nicholson says damn right. that doesn't happen. but what happened this time is that john guy made sure that all the inconsistencies that really that michael dunn had came out in the rebuttal case.
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and i thought that was so, so very effective. >> mark, what did you make of dunn's time on the stand? >> look, dunn had to take the stand. anybody who knows anything about self-defense knows that they did not have in this case any other way to get a self-defense instruction. the problem is with a fiancee like that, who needs a wife? because she basically cut his legs off. and as good as i think he did, she was devastating to him. >> so whatever inroads he made on the stand in convincing people, you think she just completely undercut him? >> look, right. because his testimony just taken in a vacuum sounds pretty convincing. until you ask why is it that he didn't call anybody, then he said well, i can understand if he's shell shocked or something. he ended up calling somebody the
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next day. then his fiancee gets up there and pretty much undercuts that, undercuts him on the idea that he saw a gun. and that's pretty devastating stuff. a jury's going to say wait a second, if his fiancee's not going to lie for him and she's telling the truth, why would we believe anything he said? and remember, one of the reasons defendants rarely take the stand is because you don't talk about -- jurors don't talk about the prosecution case anymore, they talk about what did the defendant say. and at this point what did the defendant say is very tough for him. >> and sunny, i want to play some more of what she said. dunn said there were a lot of inconsistencies about what he said he told his fiancee. she then said as we heard before that he never said anything about a gun. here's what he said during cross-examination. let's listen. >> how did you describe the weapon? did you say it had a sword, a machete? >> gun. >> a gun. you used the word "gun" with
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rhonda rouer >> yes, i did. >> when? >> multiple times. >> so i mean that's pretty crucial, sunny. he says multiple times he said "gun" to his fiancee and she says he never said it. >> that's right. it goes to the heart of this case. for the jury to find that he acted in self-defense with this justifiable use of force, they have to believe that he saw a gun. now, if he really saw a gun and fired in self-defense, the minute he got into that car wouldn't he have said to his fiancee, oh, my gosh, someone just tried to kill me, they had a gun, a barrel of a shotgun pointed at me? well, he says he did say that but she said no, he never said it on the way to the hotel room. he never said it on the way back home. he just never said it. i have to agree with mark, which i never do, i really think that she was the pivotal witness, the star witness really for the prosecution in this case. >> also if you're concerned -- >> it's so perplexing, they
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know -- the defense knows what she's going to say. it's not like it's a surprise. you've got all of this stuff is predigested. so fest thif that's going to hay are you putting this guy on to set himself up to get his legs cut off? >> if you're a concerned citizen, packing a gun you've just shot into a vehicle and you claim that there's a bunch of teenagers riding around with a weapon in their car, you would think he would call the police and say, there's some teens with guns in their car. >> of course. >> it doesn't hold up. anyway, mark will continue to follow it, sunny as well. let us know what you think as well. follow me on twitter. up next, they say they're sending out tens of millions of dollars worth of medical supplies to one of the neediest countries on earth. a charity that sounds like a great thing. the question is, why can't anyone find a trace of all those things they're supposedly sending? drew griffin has been looking, tonight he gets access to some of the group's books chasing the
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money. you'll want to see what he found. the man who did so much to honor the greatest generation now fighting perhaps his biggest battle. tom brokaw revealing his struggle with cancer. dr. sanjay dogupta joins us tonight. ♪ [ male announcer ] your heart. it powers your body to walk enough stairs in a lifetime to climb the empire state building. and then climb it again 1,000 times. your heart is amazing. take care of it with centrum silver. multivitamins with b vitamins and lycopene to help support your heart and packed with key nutrients to help support your eyes and brain, too. centrum silver. for the most amazing parts of you. there was a boy who traveled to a faraway place where villages floated on water
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charities that are very bad among the worst at putting your donations to work for the people who need it. they are however as you've seen in our reporting over the years very good at other things, namely making questionable claims about the work they say they do with your money and giving reporters the run around. over and over our drew griffin along with tampa bay times and center for investigative reporting have exposed these questionable charities. he tried last night following what some of these outfits claim were tens of millions of dollars in medical supplies all the way
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to guatemala. a chance tonight to actually look at some of their books. >> reporter: in 2010 and 2011, if you believe the paperwork, 15 american charities sent $47 million worth of medicines and other donations to guatemala, most unloaded here at wouldn't country's two main ports. a journey that began here in south carolina in a business called charity services international whose president, roy tidwell, told us back in 2012 gathering and sending charitable goods is all he does. >> we send on behalf of our charities out to these organization. we just handle the shipping. >> reporter: but in hundreds of internal records from charity services international, those millions in donations show a disturbing pattern. identical shipments claimed to be sent by several charities and all for the exact same amount. take a look. four identical donations here
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down to the nickel. 2 million $792,000. the charities claiming credit for sending the donation all listed by their initials. the breast cancer society, the children's cancer fund of america, cancer fund of america and breast cancer charities of america. all the donations to guatemala and all to a small charity there called the order of malta. the shipper said it was actually one huge donation the charities split four ways. if that sounds suspect, it's why we went to guatemala searching for any signs of a huge medical shipment. [ speaking foreign language ] >> reporter: or even evidence that a charity or hospital or even a clinic down here received charitable goods. we came up empty. the charities wouldn't talk to us, and that includes the head of the breast cancer society who last year gave us the finger.
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>> where are you go, mr. reynolds? mr. reynolds? where are taking off? >> reporter: the question is how can these little-known charities take tax credit for shipping millions of dollars in medicines to guatemala. it's all in the back door brokering of noncash donations, what charities call gifts in kind. critics call that an easy way for pretty bad charities to look pretty good. by overvaluing their donations. how? tom tague was disgusted when he found out. he runs a reputable charity called direct relief. from his warehouse in california, he supplies free medicines to rural clinics in the u.s., to disasters overseas, to almost any medical relief team that needs medicines. it's all free. he says when he had leftover medicines, he sent it to another charity so they could find a good use for it. the value of the medicines he
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sent? $3 million. within the week, he had a thank you letter for his $100 million donation. >> you personally know that is true. >> right. well, we've seen examples, including with products that we have given and assigned a value to which we know is correct, and then seen it in the handoff to another charitable organization be revalued at as many as, i don't know, 40 times higher, which is absurd. >> reporter: tigue tracked down what happened and found a man named cliff feldman, a broker who lives in florida, was working with charity service international in that south carolina warehouse and according to these e-mails was getting paid $2500 each time he handled the paperwork. the paperwork says tigue was disturbing. >> the reason to make it appear bigger is to make them appear like they're doing more good. >> that's the only thing i can think. we've been at this for 65 years
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at direct relief. we've never been the largest one. we take a very conservative approach to these things. these are medications that people are going to ingest for their health. so there's no point in getting clever with anything including how it's valued for the purposes of appearing to the outside world. >> reporter: tigue cut all ties with feldman so have other charities who no longer have any faith in how he places values on donated goods. what's feldman's answer to all this? >> mr. feldman, drew griffin with cnn. i called and left a message from guatemala. i'm now standing outside the gates of your community. >> reporter: not surprisingly, the man who helped all these charities with their accounting lives here, inside a gated community of expensive homes in south florida. and no, he is not talking. as for the shipping company, a law enforcement source says charity services international is under investigation. roy tidwell who runs the company
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says hoe did pay feldman for his services but that it is up to individual charities to put values on their own donations, which again raises the question why all four of our charities sending aid to guatemala came up with the same value of goods down to the nickel. remember, 2 million 7902.05. but an even bigger question remains. where is it? in a country filled with people desperate for help, $50 million in donated medicines is nowhere to be found. >> it's just unbelievable. drew joins us. you never found any evidence that the $15 million in medicine was ever even sent to guatemala. can these charities get in trouble if in fact there never was a donation? >> reporter: trying to hold these charities accountable is very difficult for the irs, for state governments. they're very labor intensive, complex, time consuming investigations. and often because the laws are so lax, the best you can do on
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the other side of this is maybe get a fine. so until now we have not seen many charities being prosecuted or really even investigated. >> it boils down what, donor beware? >> reporter: until now, yes, donor beware. but that could be changing after all this news we've been generating on this. several attorneys general from across the country are beginning to tell us, enough is enough. they're trying to figure out a way to stop these bad charities from pandering for our money only to use that money, anderson, for everything but charity. >> all right, drew, stay on it. it's infuriating. breaking news, veteran nbc news anchor tom brokaw revealing he has cans cancer. dr. sanjay gupta joins me ahead. and you'll hear from the zoo's decision to kill a healthy young 2-year-old giraffe and feed its body to lions while kids watched after it was being autopsied for children. we have a lot of questions for him. also jack hannah joins us ahead.
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welcome back. breaking news tonight, veteran nbc news anchor tom brokaw shared very personal news tonight revealing he has cancer. he was diagnosed in august with multiple myelom aa. in a statement he said "with the exceptional support of my family, medical team and friends, i am very optimistic about the future and look forward to continuing my life,
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my work and adventures still to come. i remain the luckiest guy i know." chief medical correspondent dr. sanjay gupta joins us tonight. >> sanjay, what is multiple myeloma? >> it's a type of cancer, specifically cancer of cells within the bone marrow. the area in the middle of your bone. you get all these different cells that are produced there. one of the cells in that bone marijuar marrow starts growing too rapidly and crowds out the other cells. it's in a similar class as leukemia and lymphoma. >> the statement says the doctors are optimistic about the outcome of the treatment he's receiving. >> this is a serious cancer. there's no specific cure for it. it very much depends on what stage it's caught and how someone is responding to therapy. i sort of read the same statement and read into that that there's all sorts of different treatments available. what you have to do with this type of cancer is you basically
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want to kill all the various cells within the bone marrow. you want to kill out the plasma cells, which are the cancerous cells and recreate the marrow. it's a long involved process. that's the type of treatment he's undergoing. >> it that chemotherapy? >> it's a type of chemotherapy. the chemotherapy is targeting the cells within the bone marrow. the problem is you need good cells in the bone marrow. white blood cells, red blood cells, platelets. eventually you have to give those cells back to the body. if for a time period the patient doesn't have enough cells and you have to eventually give those back slowly. >> he's obviously a very active guy. the fact he's continued to work on projects for nbc news throughout the treatment what does that tell you? >> there are all sorts of symptoms the people develop. it depends on what stage they are. if it was caught early it wouldn't be that surprising. . i could tell you one of the
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earliest symptoms people develop sometimes is bone pain or back pain specifically. they get little lesions in the bone, for example on somebody's skull. but those punched out lesions tend to cause pain. and that's what somebody typically goes to the doctor for. they may not have any other symptoms. but they may eventually develop fatigue, may develop sort of more profound symptoms as time goes on. but if it's early he could be doing just fine. >> is it known what causes multiple myeloma? >> they don't know for sure. some people believe there's a genetic glitch in people. it's sort of a cancer switch that is stuck in the on position, if you will. there has been some research into looking at environmental exposures from all sorts of different things, exposure to radiation. but there's no definitive cause. we don't know for sure. >> sanjay gupta, appreciate it. thanks. >> thank you. >> we certainly wish tom the best. just ahead i'm going to talk to the man who stands by his
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zoo's decision to kill a young, healthy giraffe and cut up its body, autopsy it in front of children and feed it to lions all while young people watch. jack hannah will weigh in. decio settle this. a steel cage death match of midsize sedans. the volkswagen passat against all comers. turbocharged engines against...engines. best in class rear legroom against other-class legroom. but then we realized. consumers already did that. twice. huh. maybe that's why nobody else showed up. how does one get out of a death cage? right now, lease the 2014 passat s for $179 a month which includes a $500 bonus. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. yeah. everybody knows that. did you know there is an oldest trick in the book? what? trick number one. look-est over there. ha ha. made-est thou look.
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tonight, a story a 360 follow on a story a zoo in denmark killed a perfectly
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healthy young giraffe simply because his genes weren't good for their own breeding program. instead of preventing him from breeding or giving him away to another zoo they shot him. then in the name of public education they did an autopsy in front of children, cut up his body in front of children. the children then saw him being fed to the zoo's big cats. the zoo says it's good for children to see the unvarnished reality of young animals. another reality the zoo had not one but multiple offers from other zoos to actually adopt the giraffe. it didn't need to be killed. it turned them all done. we've learned that marius is not an exception. other animals are killed there to prevent overbreeding. >> mr. holtz, i've seen reports that other zoos, private philanthropists were willing to step in and make sure this giraffe wasn't killed. why not do that? why kit the giraffe? >> because first of all because
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it was a surplus to the population. and it's right that we got two offers from other zoos. but they were not real offers. because one of these zoos was already part of the breeding program, so they had been considered already when we did the basic analysis of the program to see where this male would fit in genetically. the other one was outside the program and didn't work according to the same values as we do. i mean, by not selling animals to anyone. we exchange animals for free. and we don't want to sell -- we don't want to send our animal to places where we don't know what happens to it after we have delivered it. >> what's worse that could happen to an animal, though, than being killed? i mean, you say you don't want to send to it a place you don't know what's going to happen to it. you know what's going to happen to it at year place. >> yeah, well, of course. but the most important thing for us is that an animal has to have
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a good life as long as it lives, be be it short life or long life. it has to be a good life. if you send it to a place where you cannot take responsibility for it anymore, you risk it going to what we would call a substandard place. and then it will live there -- could live there for 15, 20 years on substandard conditions. that would be suffering for 20 years. that's not the way to work with animals. >> but doesn't the life of the animal itself have some value rather than just it being part of your breeding program? >> yes, it does. but it has a value and that's why we say it has a value as long as it lives. it has to have a good life as long as it lives. >> you're saying it has value as long as it lives and you're the one killing it. >> yes. but we human beings are the ones controlling animals' lives all the time. we do it for our domestic animals, we do it for the animals in the parks, in the forests, on the open land. we do it everywhere. >> i saw an article a few years ago you were quoted as saying your zoo euthanizes 20 to 30
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healthy animals a case. that is still the case? >> this is an average over ten years. it goes up and down every year. from llamas, goats, not only exotic animals. if you have a breeding program, if you want to breed and have a healthy population you have to renew the population currently. and you can only do that by breeding. >> the other issue, of course, is the autopsy in front of children. and i know you said it's an educational experience and it was good for them to see what the real world is. some of those kids looked pretty young. do you still feel that way after the backlash that you've gotten about this? >> yes. because i saw the autopsy, i saw the reaction of the kids and the parents. and what's really fascinating to see how fascinated they became by seeing this. we have done it before, not with a giraffe but with a bear, with wolves and with a snake, et cetera. and i think it's very important that people see the wonders of animals, not only when they're alive but also when they're
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dead. and i think we need some discussions also about life and death. and that we can show to our public. and there may be cultural differences between the united states and europe and denmark. but in our country, it's not that unusual. >> mr. holtz, i appreciate your time. >> jack hannah is on the program tonight. jack, you heard what the scientific director of the zoo said. what do you think? >> well, astounded. that's the word that i can't get up there above astounded. >> i don't quite understand what -- i mean, he seemed adamant that there was no other option basically for this giraffe. the european zoos have a certain standard. they couldn't give to it any other zoo. and even some of the zoos they could give it to it was a matter of space. it seems like people go to great
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lengths to adopt dogs to save them from being killed. it seems like adopting a giraffe for a zoo to -- some zoo somewhere would be able to take this giraffe. >> there were others in europe that could have taken it. that will become shortly. who are we to judge, anderson, who should live and not live a short life? yes, we have sustainability and a lot of room we need in zoos. that's why certain places are built to take some of these animals. that's why we have a problem sometimes with people who don't believe it zoos. >> is it normal for a zoo to be killing so many animals a year? >> no. anderson, i've never heard anything like it. i've been doing this for 40 years. i do a lot of zoos in this country. if somebody does something to an animal that goes down whatever happens to the animal is up to the zoo. the association of zookeepers we're trying to educate people to love the giraffe, to understand what nature is about. 98% of our animals are born in other zoos, not taken from the wild. i appreciate he says it's neat
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for them to know how they're taken down in the wild. >> it's also one thing to have an animal eat another animal in the wild. it's another thing to have an animal autopsied and dissected in front of a group of school children. i'm not sure i would waumnt to watch that. >> no, anderson. what it is, he's using the word "autopsy." now was that said several days ago when i heard the word they shot the animal? >> they shot the animal. >> why would you do an autopsy on an animal that you shot? if this was like a murder or somebody snuck in the zoo, yeah, an autopsy. we know why he died. he got shot. >> what he seems to be saying is that the animal itself doesn't really have any right to live. or the animal itself, there's no inherent value in the animal living out its natural life, which just seems odd for -- i mean, zoos in the united states are spending tens of millions of dollars to try to recreate habitats, to try to give polar bears an existence that is one
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like the one they would have in the wild. it just seems odd that there's no sense from this guy that the animal itself, the life of the animal actually matters. it's just a product in the breeding program. >> right. i like that term you use, a product in the breeding program. anderson, this is a living creature. it's like i was taught on our farm, my dad, and i try to teach people whether you go to a pet shop or wherever you buy a pet or whatever. you have an obligation to that animal. that's a living creature. god put that creature on earth for certain reasons. it teaches responsibility, it teaches love. that's what the zoological world does. >> if you're killing 20 to 30 exotic animals a year because they don't fit into your breeding program anymore, it starts to question what's the value of this breeding program if it's not even dangan endange animal. i know the zoo wants to keep a stock going and attract people.
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at some person the animals themselves should have a right to actually having a life. >> they sure should, shouldn't they? we are now trying to build places in this country, our country, to take surplus animals where they can live out their regular lives. also a place where older animals can live out their regular lives. we might have have to euthanize them if they're sick. that's a different situation. we have habitats to try to resemble what the wild is, teach people what they have never seen. you are one of the few reporters that have gotten out there and understand why it's so important. that's what is important because you've learned yourself you and me out in the wild. how many people can do that? not 1/10 of 1%. we're trying to bring that to them in a humane way and take care of the animals for their lifetime. >> it just seems odd. i kind of wonder if the zoo has a poster somewhere that says, enjoy our animals. we're going to kill 20 of them this year. but enjoy them while they last. no one i think knowing that would kind of keep going to that
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zoo. it just seems an odd set of priorities. jack hannah, i appreciate you coming on to talk about this. >> thanks, anderson, for all your help. up next, a desperate rescue effort is under way right now in utah for a man buried by an after laman avalanche. we're going to talk an expert that says skiers and snowboarders can survive an avalanche if they have the right equipment ahead. ♪
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rescue operation in use for a man buried in an avalanche. officials say the man was snowmobiling today when the avalanche struck. neighboring coloradoen search and rescue team found the body of a skier today. they say he got caught in an avalanche yesterday while skiing in the back country of the rocky mountains west of denver. his death is being investigated by the director of the colorado mountain -- four people have been killed in avalanches. every year in this country more than two dozen people die in them, but armed with the right equipment you can actually survive one. gary tuchman ton shows us how. >> reporter: a back country ski outing in switzerland. that is about to turn into a horrifying experience. christopher carlson, who was wearing a helmet cam, came very close to documenting his own death. it's an avalanche. he is buried about five feet
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under the snow, unable to move. [ yelling ] >> carlson is hoping the skiers he was with find him before he suffocates. and they do. he's a very lucky man. on the average in the u.s., 28 people die each year from avalanches, often with hundreds of tons of snow plummeting down the mountain. i ski at colorado's copper mountain with one of the top avalanche experts in the united states. >> how are the conditions? >> good for skiing. >> reporter: ethan green is the director of the colorado avalanche information center. his state agency's responsibility in part to forecast the probability of avalanches. >> this is mayflower gulch. >> reporter: he takes me away from the resort and into the back country where most avalanches occur to learn about the three essentials for back country skiers. >> beacon, probe, shovel.
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the beacon. we all put on one of these and turn them out so they're transmitting. later in the day if you get buried in an avalanche i'll be able to set mine to receive, pick up your signal and locate you. >> reporter: the probe and shovel. >> this is a three-meter probe pole. what this allows me to do once i get your general location with the beacon i can pinpoint you with this probe and then use the shovel to dig down to the tip. >> reporter: this fourth item can keep you above the rampaging snow threatening to bury you, the air bag pack. we dug a three-foot-deep hole in the snow to simulate what an avalanche victim might be trapped. our plan, to send ethan green up the mountain with his beacon in receive mode to try to pick up my signal from the hole where i will wait for a rescue. our producer puts the finishing touches on my snow cave, and i wait in the dark underground.
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>> okay. so i'm turning on to receive. >> reporter: no signal right away. but quickly -- >> got a signal. >> reporter: -- it tells him how close he's getting. >> 16 meters, 13 meters. >> reporter: the beacon works like a charm. okay. i'm less than a meter. i have a strike. >> wow. that was quite unsettling under there. so glad your beacon worked. >> me, too. >> thanks. >> yeah. >> reporter: of course, i was always safe in my controlled environment. in real life, a victim sometimes doesn't even have a chance in a huge avalanche. >> it's so dense that you're not going to be able to dig yourself out. sometimes you can't even expand your lungs to breathe. >> reporter: but if you're alive after the snow stops moving, having the right equipment can
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mean the ditchfference between e and death. just like it did for christopher carlson. gary tuchman, cnn, copper mountain, colorado. >> it's amazing video. a programming note, starting tomorrow on 360 we're looking into a fascinating question. are babies born knowing the difference between good and evil, between good and bad? you can join that conversation tomorrow when cnn digital correspondent kelly wallace and author paul bloom join me for a live google hangout tomorrow at 1:30 eastern. you can find the link on our web site, "the ridiculist" is next. stick around. ♪ [ male announcer ] to truck guys, the truck is everything. and when you put them in charge of making an unbeatable truck, good things happen. this is the ram 1500. the 2014 motor trend truck of the year. ♪ and first ever back-to-back champion.
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time now for "the ridiculist." it finally happened, a zombie apocalypse in new york estimate apparently we now have to worry about the friend zenzied hands undead reaching out from the sidewalk grates. >> so you probably guessed it that this is some kind of hidden camera viral video.
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it promotes the new season of amc's" the walking dead." the people walking by didn't know that at the time. the mca which runs the subway system didn't give any permission. it's not the permits that concerns me. this seems to be the new thing. scare the life out of unsuspecting new yorkers for your promotional video. last month the devil baby was unleashed for the movie "devil's due." >> the last guy's reaction or lack thereof is my favorite. completely new york. that's not my favorite part. let me show you my favorite part.
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>> the projectile vomiting. that is my favorite part. i know it's hilarious to watch these videos after the fact, but do they always have to be here in new york city? we got enough to deal with, the rats, the crowds, the tourists stopping in the middle of the sidewalks, various araromas. it's enough to make liz lemmon wonder if she'll live in new york forever. >> you want to end up like that? >> no. i'm going to be like her. >> oh, there is nothing like new york in the spring. oh. >> come on. this is the capital of the world. the culture -- >> are you all right? >> he spit in my mouth. >> all i'm saying is, i like these hidden camera videos as much as the next guy. but maybe just maybe let's do some of them i don't know in cleveland for awhile. in the meantime we new yorkers are a savvy lot. we get it. we'll be on the lookout from now
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on always for unmanned trollers carrying puking demon babies for zombies in the subway grates. we're ready for anything on "the ridiculist." that does it for us. we'll see you again one hour from now. another edition of "ac 360." thanks for watching, "piers morgan live" starts now. this is "piers morgan live." welcome to our viewers in the united states and around the world. breaking news tonight. tom brokaw reveals he's being treated for cancer. i'll talk to his former colleague debra norville and dr. sanjay gupta. at the white house president obama is hosting his first state dinner in almost two years. a scandal plagued french president. meanwhile a -- will hillary clinton's private thoughts about her husband bill and monica liewinski come back to haunt her if she runs. also best actor nominee bruce dern. >> going to "lincoln" is the last thing i.


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